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	<title>Comments on: What&#8217;s wrong with this picture?</title>
	<atom:link href="http://blogs.law.harvard.edu/doc/2008/02/12/whats-wrong-with-this-picture-2/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://blogs.law.harvard.edu/doc/2008/02/12/whats-wrong-with-this-picture-2/</link>
	<description>Same old blog, brand new place</description>
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		<title>By: vbonnaire</title>
		<link>http://blogs.law.harvard.edu/doc/2008/02/12/whats-wrong-with-this-picture-2/comment-page-1/#comment-36285</link>
		<dc:creator>vbonnaire</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 10 Apr 2008 21:31:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.law.harvard.edu/doc/2008/02/12/whats-wrong-with-this-picture-2/#comment-36285</guid>
		<description>Plenty! When it comes to the target-marketing going on.  It&#039;s been months since I dropped by post the whole W Mc C era pressmelt -- when you so heroically stepped forward with the fire pix (overhead views)  I came by to ask you a question about what &quot;netroots&quot; are?

I&#039;ve seen something hideously distressing regarding fundraising efforts and ethics.  At any rate, good to hear that you are past the ill health on your front page, and I&#039;m glad you&#039;re here!  This site is so clean looking too!  Very nice.  Nice to see you again from an old friend who was once S                 B                      *</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Plenty! When it comes to the target-marketing going on.  It&#8217;s been months since I dropped by post the whole W Mc C era pressmelt &#8212; when you so heroically stepped forward with the fire pix (overhead views)  I came by to ask you a question about what &#8220;netroots&#8221; are?</p>
<p>I&#8217;ve seen something hideously distressing regarding fundraising efforts and ethics.  At any rate, good to hear that you are past the ill health on your front page, and I&#8217;m glad you&#8217;re here!  This site is so clean looking too!  Very nice.  Nice to see you again from an old friend who was once S                 B                      *</p>
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		<title>By: Tony Steidler-Dennison</title>
		<link>http://blogs.law.harvard.edu/doc/2008/02/12/whats-wrong-with-this-picture-2/comment-page-1/#comment-27405</link>
		<dc:creator>Tony Steidler-Dennison</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 15 Feb 2008 19:11:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.law.harvard.edu/doc/2008/02/12/whats-wrong-with-this-picture-2/#comment-27405</guid>
		<description>Having jumped headfirst into a deep pool of idealism in &#039;04 (not only about the candidate, but about the possibility of pushing FOSS tools into another important mainstream), I started out viewing this election a bit differently. I love Obama&#039;s message of hope - the idealist in me. I love his mastery of imagery with words - again, the idealist. But I also admire the skills he&#039;s shown in organizing and executing his campaign. 

Cam&#039;s comment above, which I agree with perfectly, illustrates just some of the practical difficulties in getting through a primary to a general election. It&#039;s tough to manage and focus a group of people with incredibly varying degrees of self-interest. 

Along those lines, Joe Klein nailed it yesterday in an article for Time:

http://www.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,1713497,00.html

And, when you take the view to that level, isn&#039;t that really the first job of a president: to define and communicate a vision, then lead and motivate?

Just my thoughts, but that ability in Obama is yet another reason to disable my own cynicism.

And Clark, by the way, is out working for Hillary these days. I don&#039;t think a VP slot, should she get the nomination, is out of the question.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Having jumped headfirst into a deep pool of idealism in &#8216;04 (not only about the candidate, but about the possibility of pushing FOSS tools into another important mainstream), I started out viewing this election a bit differently. I love Obama&#8217;s message of hope &#8211; the idealist in me. I love his mastery of imagery with words &#8211; again, the idealist. But I also admire the skills he&#8217;s shown in organizing and executing his campaign. </p>
<p>Cam&#8217;s comment above, which I agree with perfectly, illustrates just some of the practical difficulties in getting through a primary to a general election. It&#8217;s tough to manage and focus a group of people with incredibly varying degrees of self-interest. </p>
<p>Along those lines, Joe Klein nailed it yesterday in an article for Time:</p>
<p><a href="http://www.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,1713497,00.html" rel="nofollow">http://www.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,1713497,00.html</a></p>
<p>And, when you take the view to that level, isn&#8217;t that really the first job of a president: to define and communicate a vision, then lead and motivate?</p>
<p>Just my thoughts, but that ability in Obama is yet another reason to disable my own cynicism.</p>
<p>And Clark, by the way, is out working for Hillary these days. I don&#8217;t think a VP slot, should she get the nomination, is out of the question.</p>
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		<title>By: Cameron Barrett</title>
		<link>http://blogs.law.harvard.edu/doc/2008/02/12/whats-wrong-with-this-picture-2/comment-page-1/#comment-27400</link>
		<dc:creator>Cameron Barrett</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 15 Feb 2008 18:45:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.law.harvard.edu/doc/2008/02/12/whats-wrong-with-this-picture-2/#comment-27400</guid>
		<description>Of course, I don&#039;t discount those people working in politics who are in it for the greater good, as opposed to those who are in politics only for their own good. I met and worked with some great people at Clark 04 but I also saw how the campaign was influenced and disrupted by those who cared more about securing their futures in politics than securing the nomination for the candidate. Some of the resistance we saw to cutting edge ideas was purely because certain individuals wanted to retain their control and influence within the campaign.

As I tell my friends who ask me who I want to win the nomination, &quot;With Obama it seems that we truly have a chance to affect change within this country, and with Hillary we get nothing but 4 or more years of the same crap that we Americans are sick and tired of.&quot;

We certainly do not need the years and years of political baggage Hillary brings along with her. I can easily see 4 years of gridlocked votes in the Senate and the House because the Republicans hate the Clintons so much. For some reason I don&#039;t see it the same if Obama were president.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Of course, I don&#8217;t discount those people working in politics who are in it for the greater good, as opposed to those who are in politics only for their own good. I met and worked with some great people at Clark 04 but I also saw how the campaign was influenced and disrupted by those who cared more about securing their futures in politics than securing the nomination for the candidate. Some of the resistance we saw to cutting edge ideas was purely because certain individuals wanted to retain their control and influence within the campaign.</p>
<p>As I tell my friends who ask me who I want to win the nomination, &#8220;With Obama it seems that we truly have a chance to affect change within this country, and with Hillary we get nothing but 4 or more years of the same crap that we Americans are sick and tired of.&#8221;</p>
<p>We certainly do not need the years and years of political baggage Hillary brings along with her. I can easily see 4 years of gridlocked votes in the Senate and the House because the Republicans hate the Clintons so much. For some reason I don&#8217;t see it the same if Obama were president.</p>
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		<title>By: Doc Searls</title>
		<link>http://blogs.law.harvard.edu/doc/2008/02/12/whats-wrong-with-this-picture-2/comment-page-1/#comment-27393</link>
		<dc:creator>Doc Searls</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 15 Feb 2008 16:21:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.law.harvard.edu/doc/2008/02/12/whats-wrong-with-this-picture-2/#comment-27393</guid>
		<description>Great points from all of you, especially Cam and Tony, who worked their butts off four years ago for the Wesley Clark campaign. (Whatever happened to that guy? He&#039;d make a great VP candidate, I&#039;d think.)

I knew mail lists were important, but not so important that it excuses the slightly ickyu way the Obama folks design their index page.

What still appeals to me about Obama is that he&#039;s the first candidate in many years to disable my cynicism. 

Of course, I&#039;m still giving him a chance. :-)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Great points from all of you, especially Cam and Tony, who worked their butts off four years ago for the Wesley Clark campaign. (Whatever happened to that guy? He&#8217;d make a great VP candidate, I&#8217;d think.)</p>
<p>I knew mail lists were important, but not so important that it excuses the slightly ickyu way the Obama folks design their index page.</p>
<p>What still appeals to me about Obama is that he&#8217;s the first candidate in many years to disable my cynicism. </p>
<p>Of course, I&#8217;m still giving him a chance. <img src='http://blogs.law.harvard.edu/doc/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':-)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
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		<title>By: Tony Steidler-Dennison</title>
		<link>http://blogs.law.harvard.edu/doc/2008/02/12/whats-wrong-with-this-picture-2/comment-page-1/#comment-27381</link>
		<dc:creator>Tony Steidler-Dennison</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 15 Feb 2008 14:40:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.law.harvard.edu/doc/2008/02/12/whats-wrong-with-this-picture-2/#comment-27381</guid>
		<description>This wouldn&#039;t be too tough an issue to fix. It would be a good use of a cookie to be able to skip the front page if the user has either signed up already or skipped the page on their first visit. It&#039;s a small annoyance to supporters that could be solved with minimal effort.

Overall, I have to agree with Cam. Obama&#039;s web presence has been very strong and seems much more mature than we&#039;ve seen in the past, Notwithstanding the front page issue (and the disappearance of his podcast), they seem to have a strong modern view of online campaigning.

I&#039;d marginally disagree with Cameron on one point. I&#039;d term many of the folks who gravitate to these campaigns as, well, ambitious. In some cases, it&#039;s ambition fed by a real belief in a greater goal. In some, it&#039;s ambition for purely personal reasons. That&#039;s not so different than a lot of other work environments. There are &quot;climbers&quot; everywhere. I met quite a few altruistically-motivated people in the Clark campaign in &#039;04 (Cameron among them) - folks who really believed in the candidate and saw the work as something of a higher calling. I wouldn&#039;t paint the entire population of political workers with a broad brush, though there are clearly some involved with blindly self-seeking motives.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This wouldn&#8217;t be too tough an issue to fix. It would be a good use of a cookie to be able to skip the front page if the user has either signed up already or skipped the page on their first visit. It&#8217;s a small annoyance to supporters that could be solved with minimal effort.</p>
<p>Overall, I have to agree with Cam. Obama&#8217;s web presence has been very strong and seems much more mature than we&#8217;ve seen in the past, Notwithstanding the front page issue (and the disappearance of his podcast), they seem to have a strong modern view of online campaigning.</p>
<p>I&#8217;d marginally disagree with Cameron on one point. I&#8217;d term many of the folks who gravitate to these campaigns as, well, ambitious. In some cases, it&#8217;s ambition fed by a real belief in a greater goal. In some, it&#8217;s ambition for purely personal reasons. That&#8217;s not so different than a lot of other work environments. There are &#8220;climbers&#8221; everywhere. I met quite a few altruistically-motivated people in the Clark campaign in &#8216;04 (Cameron among them) &#8211; folks who really believed in the candidate and saw the work as something of a higher calling. I wouldn&#8217;t paint the entire population of political workers with a broad brush, though there are clearly some involved with blindly self-seeking motives.</p>
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		<title>By: Cameron Barrett</title>
		<link>http://blogs.law.harvard.edu/doc/2008/02/12/whats-wrong-with-this-picture-2/comment-page-1/#comment-27299</link>
		<dc:creator>Cameron Barrett</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 14 Feb 2008 21:24:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.law.harvard.edu/doc/2008/02/12/whats-wrong-with-this-picture-2/#comment-27299</guid>
		<description>I honestly don&#039;t have any problem with this implementation. It&#039;d only be annoying of they hid the Skip button for 10 seconds like some advertisers do with Flash ads.

What some people are not understanding is that a database of email addresses and potential contributors is the &quot;golden egg&quot; of every campaign. This database gets used, re-used, abused, sold, re-sold to every other campaign, PAC, 501.3c and affiliated organization in the future - no matter the outcome of the election cycle. This database is what drives the fund raising - and if you need to know anything about campaigns it is that without fund raising you are essentially dead in the water.

That aside, I am quite impressed by Obama&#039;s web site and online campaigns. He seems to be everywhere, advertising on the political blogs and elsewhere. If I weren&#039;t so disgusted with the entire political industry I&#039;d have found my way into his campaign a while back. But no, I&#039;m done with politics. Probably, for good. My skin is thick but not thick enough to deal with the slime that the political industry attracts. Nasty, nasty people...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I honestly don&#8217;t have any problem with this implementation. It&#8217;d only be annoying of they hid the Skip button for 10 seconds like some advertisers do with Flash ads.</p>
<p>What some people are not understanding is that a database of email addresses and potential contributors is the &#8220;golden egg&#8221; of every campaign. This database gets used, re-used, abused, sold, re-sold to every other campaign, PAC, 501.3c and affiliated organization in the future &#8211; no matter the outcome of the election cycle. This database is what drives the fund raising &#8211; and if you need to know anything about campaigns it is that without fund raising you are essentially dead in the water.</p>
<p>That aside, I am quite impressed by Obama&#8217;s web site and online campaigns. He seems to be everywhere, advertising on the political blogs and elsewhere. If I weren&#8217;t so disgusted with the entire political industry I&#8217;d have found my way into his campaign a while back. But no, I&#8217;m done with politics. Probably, for good. My skin is thick but not thick enough to deal with the slime that the political industry attracts. Nasty, nasty people&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: everysandwich</title>
		<link>http://blogs.law.harvard.edu/doc/2008/02/12/whats-wrong-with-this-picture-2/comment-page-1/#comment-27296</link>
		<dc:creator>everysandwich</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 14 Feb 2008 20:38:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.law.harvard.edu/doc/2008/02/12/whats-wrong-with-this-picture-2/#comment-27296</guid>
		<description>I had the exact same reaction. I&#039;m embarrassed to admit I never did see the skip button and had to find actual content through a search engine. The sign-up for phone badgering page seemed useful for the campaign, though. Now, anyone up for a Talk Like Obama Day? It&#039;s basically high concepts uttered in a triad of parallelism. Try it. It&#039;s fun!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I had the exact same reaction. I&#8217;m embarrassed to admit I never did see the skip button and had to find actual content through a search engine. The sign-up for phone badgering page seemed useful for the campaign, though. Now, anyone up for a Talk Like Obama Day? It&#8217;s basically high concepts uttered in a triad of parallelism. Try it. It&#8217;s fun!</p>
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		<title>By: Jason Lefkowitz</title>
		<link>http://blogs.law.harvard.edu/doc/2008/02/12/whats-wrong-with-this-picture-2/comment-page-1/#comment-27173</link>
		<dc:creator>Jason Lefkowitz</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 13 Feb 2008 21:45:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.law.harvard.edu/doc/2008/02/12/whats-wrong-with-this-picture-2/#comment-27173</guid>
		<description>Internet people for advocacy organizations (like political campaigns) are typically evaluated by their bosses on one overriding metric:

How much did you grow the email list this [week &#124; month &#124; quarter &#124; year &#124; whatever ]?

Given that, it becomes less surprising that these sites tend to be... ahem... *aggressive* in their attempts to gather email addresses.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Internet people for advocacy organizations (like political campaigns) are typically evaluated by their bosses on one overriding metric:</p>
<p>How much did you grow the email list this [week | month | quarter | year | whatever ]?</p>
<p>Given that, it becomes less surprising that these sites tend to be&#8230; ahem&#8230; *aggressive* in their attempts to gather email addresses.</p>
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		<title>By: Kyle</title>
		<link>http://blogs.law.harvard.edu/doc/2008/02/12/whats-wrong-with-this-picture-2/comment-page-1/#comment-27154</link>
		<dc:creator>Kyle</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 13 Feb 2008 20:22:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.law.harvard.edu/doc/2008/02/12/whats-wrong-with-this-picture-2/#comment-27154</guid>
		<description>I had a negative reaction too: I don&#039;t like being herded.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I had a negative reaction too: I don&#8217;t like being herded.</p>
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		<title>By: bruce fryer</title>
		<link>http://blogs.law.harvard.edu/doc/2008/02/12/whats-wrong-with-this-picture-2/comment-page-1/#comment-27141</link>
		<dc:creator>bruce fryer</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 13 Feb 2008 19:13:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.law.harvard.edu/doc/2008/02/12/whats-wrong-with-this-picture-2/#comment-27141</guid>
		<description>I guess I wouldn&#039;t have minded if they would have floated this over the main website.  That&#039;s how most folks do it.   

And where&#039;s the paypal button?   

Full Disclosure: I live in Utah.  It doesn&#039;t matter how I vote.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I guess I wouldn&#8217;t have minded if they would have floated this over the main website.  That&#8217;s how most folks do it.   </p>
<p>And where&#8217;s the paypal button?   </p>
<p>Full Disclosure: I live in Utah.  It doesn&#8217;t matter how I vote.</p>
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