Comments on: Johannesburg versus Iraq

By: Graham Waiting

Graham Waiting — Sun, 04 Mar 2007 21:48:42 +0000

If Sreedar is mathematically correct in death statistics (and I question that), then the conclusion is that SA is still a dangerous place. But as an ExPat now living near Boston, I will remember forever the physical beauty of the country and the Cape rates a 10 on a scale of 10. Take lots of photos. If you like wine, try the Cabernets there. They don’t travel well but there are many vineyards you can visit around the Stellenbosch region where you can savor the nectar of the Gods. And DO visit the game reserves. I miss that more than anything.
graham

By: Michael-John Turner

Michael-John Turner — Sat, 03 Mar 2007 14:07:46 +0000

I live in Cape Town and have spent extended periods in Johannesburg on business (and lived there in 2002). I have many colleagues who still live and work in Johannesburg and almost all them have been affected by or know someone who has been affected by crime. That said, although the figures may prove me wrong, I somehow doubt that more people are killed there than in Iraq…

Like Gordon said, Cape Town and Johannesburg are worlds apart. Although there is crime here, it’s a fairly safe place – just keep your wits about you and you’ll be fine. Looing forward to reading reports of your travels.

By: Sreedar

Sreedar — Wed, 28 Feb 2007 18:06:04 +0000

The claim is demonstrably wrong.

Excluding the death toll in Iraq so far – which ranges anywhere from 30,000 (Us Government Figures) to 655,000 (Johns Hopkins Study) with somewhere around 150,000 being the ‘accepted’ number – there are at least 2.65 times MORE deaths in Iraq than South Africa.

Here’s the rough calculation:

Population of SA (2005): 44,344,136 (http://education.yahoo.com/reference/factbook/sf/popula.html)
Number of Murders per 1,000 people (2000): 0.514 (http://www.iss.co.za/pubs/CrimeQ/No.11/Altbeker.htm)

Total Number of Murders in SA Per Year ~ 22,792

Population Of Iraq: 26,783,383
Death toll : 100 Per day= 36500 per year
http://www.nytimes.com/2006/07/19/world/middleeast/19iraq.html?ex=1310961600&en=63fa30b7b648ac31&ei=5088&partner=rssnyt&emc=rss
Number of war-related Deaths per 1,000 people (2006): 1.36

Total Number war-related Deaths in Iraq Per Year ~ 36,500

If we take the ‘accepted’ number of 150,000 into consideration, this climbs up to 46,500 war related deaths per year.

The comparison is valid, regardless of whether you consider these deaths to be related to war or terrorism (should you wish to so consider).

By: Gordon Richardson

Gordon Richardson — Wed, 28 Feb 2007 04:51:17 +0000

South Africans traveling abroad have a tendency to denigrate their own country (for a variety of reasons). Cape Town and Johannesburg are as far apart socially (if not geographically) as Boston and California. If you do get to CT, there are a few photo.net members who would enjoy meeting you, and showing you around. April is a good time to visit IMHO.

By: billg

billg — Wed, 28 Feb 2007 01:03:40 +0000

I don’t know if that claim is literally true. I assume the student meant violent deaths. Certainly, the level of reported crime has risen dramatically since the demise of the apartheid police state. In any case, Cape Town is entrancing, if you’re able, take the drive south to the actual cape. The Indian and Atlantic oceans are different colors.

One of my favorite stories about Cape Town in the “old days” claims that, during one of the interminable negotiation sessions revolving around the war in Angola, a Cuban diplomat checked into a Cape Town hotel. Asked, as the law then required, to designate his race, the Cuban replied: “100 meter:”

By: Preston L. Bannister

Preston L. Bannister — Tue, 27 Feb 2007 04:51:32 +0000

A friend went to fetch his aging parents from South Africa a couple years back.

Zak’s RSA Saga – http://zakkong.blogspot.com/