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	<title>Comments on: How Rich Countries Die</title>
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	<link>http://blogs.law.harvard.edu/philg/2009/03/16/how-rich-countries-die/</link>
	<description>A posting every day; an interesting idea every three months...</description>
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		<title>By: Andrew S</title>
		<link>http://blogs.law.harvard.edu/philg/2009/03/16/how-rich-countries-die/comment-page-1/#comment-124227</link>
		<dc:creator>Andrew S</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 31 May 2009 20:00:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.law.harvard.edu/philg/?p=1249#comment-124227</guid>
		<description>Alaska is an exception and does not serve as a good example. Despite being relatively new, the state is full of government pork and special interest influence because of the oil dollars there.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Alaska is an exception and does not serve as a good example. Despite being relatively new, the state is full of government pork and special interest influence because of the oil dollars there.</p>
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		<title>By: zapiens</title>
		<link>http://blogs.law.harvard.edu/philg/2009/03/16/how-rich-countries-die/comment-page-1/#comment-124032</link>
		<dc:creator>zapiens</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 30 May 2009 17:35:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.law.harvard.edu/philg/?p=1249#comment-124032</guid>
		<description>The Coming of the Fourth American Republic

&quot;The Special Interest State that has shaped American life for 70 years is dying. What comes next is uncertain, but there are grounds for optimism...&quot;

http://www.american.com/archive/2009/april-2009/the-coming-of-the-fourth-american-republic

A little on the optimistic side, perhaps?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The Coming of the Fourth American Republic</p>
<p>&#8220;The Special Interest State that has shaped American life for 70 years is dying. What comes next is uncertain, but there are grounds for optimism&#8230;&#8221;</p>
<p><a href="http://www.american.com/archive/2009/april-2009/the-coming-of-the-fourth-american-republic" rel="nofollow">http://www.american.com/archive/2009/april-2009/the-coming-of-the-fourth-american-republic</a></p>
<p>A little on the optimistic side, perhaps?</p>
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		<title>By: Fibonacci</title>
		<link>http://blogs.law.harvard.edu/philg/2009/03/16/how-rich-countries-die/comment-page-1/#comment-119138</link>
		<dc:creator>Fibonacci</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 26 Apr 2009 11:29:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.law.harvard.edu/philg/?p=1249#comment-119138</guid>
		<description>Why don&#039;t free markets self-correct like my economics book told me?
See http://rudd-o.com/en/archives/why-dont-free-markets-self-correct-like-my-economics-book-told-me</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Why don&#8217;t free markets self-correct like my economics book told me?<br />
See <a href="http://rudd-o.com/en/archives/why-dont-free-markets-self-correct-like-my-economics-book-told-me" rel="nofollow">http://rudd-o.com/en/archives/why-dont-free-markets-self-correct-like-my-economics-book-told-me</a></p>
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		<title>By: Craig Meyer</title>
		<link>http://blogs.law.harvard.edu/philg/2009/03/16/how-rich-countries-die/comment-page-1/#comment-115325</link>
		<dc:creator>Craig Meyer</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 27 Mar 2009 20:37:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.law.harvard.edu/philg/?p=1249#comment-115325</guid>
		<description>It always surprises me--because I do this to--when people talk about the USA being a new country, a new society, etc.

In ways that&#039;s true, but we also have the OLDEST government in the whole world (with surely a few &quot;minor&quot; exceptions like Iceland or Switzerland or someplace.)

Huh.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It always surprises me&#8211;because I do this to&#8211;when people talk about the USA being a new country, a new society, etc.</p>
<p>In ways that&#8217;s true, but we also have the OLDEST government in the whole world (with surely a few &#8220;minor&#8221; exceptions like Iceland or Switzerland or someplace.)</p>
<p>Huh.</p>
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		<title>By: Mike Woods</title>
		<link>http://blogs.law.harvard.edu/philg/2009/03/16/how-rich-countries-die/comment-page-1/#comment-114772</link>
		<dc:creator>Mike Woods</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 25 Mar 2009 00:44:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.law.harvard.edu/philg/?p=1249#comment-114772</guid>
		<description>@philg - great entry, even if a bit depressing.  Ironically, the &#039;glimmers of hope&#039; seem far out in the distance as Obama appears to favor significant government expansion and has the skills and popularity to achieve his agenda.  After the body blows of the Bailouts and Stimulus, will we survive further government control of healthcare and industry?

@22, Scott - Your question “Is it better to be in a slow growing, stable state or a fast growing, less stable state?” is incredibly apropos.  There is a significant value judgement involved.  Through our collective actions today, we are making that choice.

I strongly believe that America has prospered for an out-sized amount of time precisely because we as a culture opted for Liberty over Security.  The &quot;cowboy&quot; was internationally famous as the icon of this mindset:  tough, self reliant, free.  Something the whole world was fascinated by.

Today, our cultural perspective is almost 180degrees opposite - with a &quot;culture of fear&quot; which pushes a nanny state, continually trading liberty for safety.  The downside to the slow stable state is the inability for the Individual to choose or affect his destiny.  Great if you are born a Gates or a Bush or a Clinton...not so great if you are born to a housekeeper.

If the US continues to stagnate, unable to escape the trap...better keep your Karma up!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@philg &#8211; great entry, even if a bit depressing.  Ironically, the &#8216;glimmers of hope&#8217; seem far out in the distance as Obama appears to favor significant government expansion and has the skills and popularity to achieve his agenda.  After the body blows of the Bailouts and Stimulus, will we survive further government control of healthcare and industry?</p>
<p>@22, Scott &#8211; Your question “Is it better to be in a slow growing, stable state or a fast growing, less stable state?” is incredibly apropos.  There is a significant value judgement involved.  Through our collective actions today, we are making that choice.</p>
<p>I strongly believe that America has prospered for an out-sized amount of time precisely because we as a culture opted for Liberty over Security.  The &#8220;cowboy&#8221; was internationally famous as the icon of this mindset:  tough, self reliant, free.  Something the whole world was fascinated by.</p>
<p>Today, our cultural perspective is almost 180degrees opposite &#8211; with a &#8220;culture of fear&#8221; which pushes a nanny state, continually trading liberty for safety.  The downside to the slow stable state is the inability for the Individual to choose or affect his destiny.  Great if you are born a Gates or a Bush or a Clinton&#8230;not so great if you are born to a housekeeper.</p>
<p>If the US continues to stagnate, unable to escape the trap&#8230;better keep your Karma up!</p>
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		<title>By: Alex Bowles</title>
		<link>http://blogs.law.harvard.edu/philg/2009/03/16/how-rich-countries-die/comment-page-1/#comment-113790</link>
		<dc:creator>Alex Bowles</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 19 Mar 2009 19:49:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.law.harvard.edu/philg/?p=1249#comment-113790</guid>
		<description>@Murali &amp; philg

You both make excellent points about the central issue, which is the use of congress as the basic mechanism for increasing the power of any cartel that wants to take for itself instead of providing for others. 

And philg, you&#039;re especially right to note that ending privately financed elections (an obvious recipe for corruption) is not the be-all-end-all solution. Rather, it is one of three essential steps that must be taken. 

The others are an and to earmark privileges, and an end to gerrymandering. Gerrymandering, of course, allows politicians to select the voters who can elect them, insulating themselves for any meaningful opposition by competing parties. And earmarks, though inconsequential in terms of the overall budget, are a great way to beat back challengers for one&#039;s seat. 

However, publicly financed elections, for people who were subject to competitive forces, and unable to choose of buy off voters could have a transformative effect on Congress. 

When the Congressional body becomes a source of fear for abusive special interests, as opposed to their most valuable tool, then we may have achieved a state of perpetual revolution that Jefferson seemed to regard as essential to the preservation of liberty.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@Murali &amp; philg</p>
<p>You both make excellent points about the central issue, which is the use of congress as the basic mechanism for increasing the power of any cartel that wants to take for itself instead of providing for others. </p>
<p>And philg, you&#8217;re especially right to note that ending privately financed elections (an obvious recipe for corruption) is not the be-all-end-all solution. Rather, it is one of three essential steps that must be taken. </p>
<p>The others are an and to earmark privileges, and an end to gerrymandering. Gerrymandering, of course, allows politicians to select the voters who can elect them, insulating themselves for any meaningful opposition by competing parties. And earmarks, though inconsequential in terms of the overall budget, are a great way to beat back challengers for one&#8217;s seat. </p>
<p>However, publicly financed elections, for people who were subject to competitive forces, and unable to choose of buy off voters could have a transformative effect on Congress. </p>
<p>When the Congressional body becomes a source of fear for abusive special interests, as opposed to their most valuable tool, then we may have achieved a state of perpetual revolution that Jefferson seemed to regard as essential to the preservation of liberty.</p>
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		<title>By: Scott Mitchell</title>
		<link>http://blogs.law.harvard.edu/philg/2009/03/16/how-rich-countries-die/comment-page-1/#comment-113621</link>
		<dc:creator>Scott Mitchell</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 18 Mar 2009 21:49:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.law.harvard.edu/philg/?p=1249#comment-113621</guid>
		<description>I wager that special interest groups are able to become more effective as the ratio between constituents and legislators grows larger. If there were, say, 10 constituents for every 1 Congressman then special interest groups would have no hope for two reasons: first, there would be way too many legislators to lobby, and second, legislators would know that they had to keep those 10 constituents happy or they would not get re-elected.

The problem with the US government, and in many states where you cite slowed economic growth, is that there are too few legislators representing too many constituents. What does my Senator in Washington care what I think when I only represent 1 out of 15,000,000 constituents?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I wager that special interest groups are able to become more effective as the ratio between constituents and legislators grows larger. If there were, say, 10 constituents for every 1 Congressman then special interest groups would have no hope for two reasons: first, there would be way too many legislators to lobby, and second, legislators would know that they had to keep those 10 constituents happy or they would not get re-elected.</p>
<p>The problem with the US government, and in many states where you cite slowed economic growth, is that there are too few legislators representing too many constituents. What does my Senator in Washington care what I think when I only represent 1 out of 15,000,000 constituents?</p>
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		<title>By: Vinny</title>
		<link>http://blogs.law.harvard.edu/philg/2009/03/16/how-rich-countries-die/comment-page-1/#comment-113569</link>
		<dc:creator>Vinny</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 18 Mar 2009 13:08:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.law.harvard.edu/philg/?p=1249#comment-113569</guid>
		<description>What we effectively need is profiling, review, and style rules for laws.  Profiling will cause hotspots will arise, helping to reduce the apparent complexity of our laws.  This will uncover surprising details that seem counterproductive, as well as vast quantities of unused complexity.  We should then revise laws to reduce their code size while maintaining their intent - what can be said in 10 words should not be allowed to be said in 1000.  Lastly we need rules for the structure of new laws to prevent bugs from creeping back in.

Luckily we have invented complex machines to help us.  They make this immense task manageable, but more importantly their existence has created a population of people who manage intent in complex systems every day.  They are an economically and politically diverse group with an inherent distrust of corruption and a bias for science and transparency.

The real difficulties would be finding a basis for profiling (likely based on opinions of lawyers and judges and possibly some machine analysis), and creating a capable political movement interested in changing our government.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>What we effectively need is profiling, review, and style rules for laws.  Profiling will cause hotspots will arise, helping to reduce the apparent complexity of our laws.  This will uncover surprising details that seem counterproductive, as well as vast quantities of unused complexity.  We should then revise laws to reduce their code size while maintaining their intent &#8211; what can be said in 10 words should not be allowed to be said in 1000.  Lastly we need rules for the structure of new laws to prevent bugs from creeping back in.</p>
<p>Luckily we have invented complex machines to help us.  They make this immense task manageable, but more importantly their existence has created a population of people who manage intent in complex systems every day.  They are an economically and politically diverse group with an inherent distrust of corruption and a bias for science and transparency.</p>
<p>The real difficulties would be finding a basis for profiling (likely based on opinions of lawyers and judges and possibly some machine analysis), and creating a capable political movement interested in changing our government.</p>
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		<title>By: bgc</title>
		<link>http://blogs.law.harvard.edu/philg/2009/03/16/how-rich-countries-die/comment-page-1/#comment-113559</link>
		<dc:creator>bgc</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 18 Mar 2009 10:37:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.law.harvard.edu/philg/?p=1249#comment-113559</guid>
		<description>Would I be correct in assuming that one implication of Olson&#039;s analysis (as described above) would be that _if_ current politicians were _really_ concerned about the present recession, than they would be focusing on micro-economics (incentives) rather than obsessing about macro/ stimulus/ interest rates etc; and that the complete ignoring of micro reform suggests that there is really _no_ attempt to treat the recession and generate growth but in fact current economic policy is _entirely_ about redistribution towards pressure groups who support the incumbent governments (including the older generation) - and that therefore the recession will _certainly_ be made deeper and longer than it would have been spontaneously?

One thing which apparently Olson failed to predict was the UK economic miracle of the 1980s, whereby several decades of relative decline was reversed and the UK moved up from being a mid-teens ranking economy to fourth in the world (for a while). 

So the declining trend of an old economy was, as a matter of fact, reversible. Maybe constructive change is possible - but it requires a political genius like Thatcher to do it. 

And the effect was temporary and the UK is now back in its bad old habits (as described by Olson) ust as in the 1970s, with no prospect of positive radical reform visible even on the horizon. 

See: &#039;Seeking a premier economy: the economic effects of British economic reforms 1980-2000&#039;, by David Card et al.

http://books.google.co.uk/books?id=XUGqOHKOWP4C&amp;dq=card+freeman+economy+britain&amp;printsec=frontcover&amp;source=bl&amp;ots=URUcq19p3q&amp;sig=bp-vJEQTBYBiYpG65OtbwPqS7kI&amp;hl=en&amp;ei=uczAScDOLZG3tweYjuDSCg&amp;sa=X&amp;oi=book_result&amp;resnum=6&amp;ct=result#PPA3,M1</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Would I be correct in assuming that one implication of Olson&#8217;s analysis (as described above) would be that _if_ current politicians were _really_ concerned about the present recession, than they would be focusing on micro-economics (incentives) rather than obsessing about macro/ stimulus/ interest rates etc; and that the complete ignoring of micro reform suggests that there is really _no_ attempt to treat the recession and generate growth but in fact current economic policy is _entirely_ about redistribution towards pressure groups who support the incumbent governments (including the older generation) &#8211; and that therefore the recession will _certainly_ be made deeper and longer than it would have been spontaneously?</p>
<p>One thing which apparently Olson failed to predict was the UK economic miracle of the 1980s, whereby several decades of relative decline was reversed and the UK moved up from being a mid-teens ranking economy to fourth in the world (for a while). </p>
<p>So the declining trend of an old economy was, as a matter of fact, reversible. Maybe constructive change is possible &#8211; but it requires a political genius like Thatcher to do it. </p>
<p>And the effect was temporary and the UK is now back in its bad old habits (as described by Olson) ust as in the 1970s, with no prospect of positive radical reform visible even on the horizon. </p>
<p>See: &#8216;Seeking a premier economy: the economic effects of British economic reforms 1980-2000&#8242;, by David Card et al.</p>
<p><a href="http://books.google.co.uk/books?id=XUGqOHKOWP4C&amp;dq=card+freeman+economy+britain&amp;printsec=frontcover&amp;source=bl&amp;ots=URUcq19p3q&amp;sig=bp-vJEQTBYBiYpG65OtbwPqS7kI&amp;hl=en&amp;ei=uczAScDOLZG3tweYjuDSCg&amp;sa=X&amp;oi=book_result&amp;resnum=6&amp;ct=result#PPA3,M1" rel="nofollow">http://books.google.co.uk/books?id=XUGqOHKOWP4C&amp;dq=card+freeman+economy+britain&amp;printsec=frontcover&amp;source=bl&amp;ots=URUcq19p3q&amp;sig=bp-vJEQTBYBiYpG65OtbwPqS7kI&amp;hl=en&amp;ei=uczAScDOLZG3tweYjuDSCg&amp;sa=X&amp;oi=book_result&amp;resnum=6&amp;ct=result#PPA3,M1</a></p>
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		<title>By: Scott Mitchell</title>
		<link>http://blogs.law.harvard.edu/philg/2009/03/16/how-rich-countries-die/comment-page-1/#comment-113496</link>
		<dc:creator>Scott Mitchell</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 18 Mar 2009 05:19:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.law.harvard.edu/philg/?p=1249#comment-113496</guid>
		<description>One question to ask yourself, though, is, &quot;Is it better to be in a slow growing, stable state or a fast growing, less stable state?&quot; Given the fact that over the past several years hundreds of people were dying per month in Iraq, I&#039;d much rather choose a slow-growing, stable state like the US, Canada, or Europe, over living in Iraq, even though I may have a great chance of advancing my social standing.

Likewise, China&#039;s growth has been explosive, and that&#039;s great if you can profit from it. However, I&#039;d wager that there are many Chinese factory workers who would trade places with a soon to be laid off automotive employee in Detroit.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>One question to ask yourself, though, is, &#8220;Is it better to be in a slow growing, stable state or a fast growing, less stable state?&#8221; Given the fact that over the past several years hundreds of people were dying per month in Iraq, I&#8217;d much rather choose a slow-growing, stable state like the US, Canada, or Europe, over living in Iraq, even though I may have a great chance of advancing my social standing.</p>
<p>Likewise, China&#8217;s growth has been explosive, and that&#8217;s great if you can profit from it. However, I&#8217;d wager that there are many Chinese factory workers who would trade places with a soon to be laid off automotive employee in Detroit.</p>
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