Thanks, Elck. I worry about my immoderately worded responses, but sometimes …. Well, there’s a long story behind my disdain for women as collaborateurs, not something to get into here.

I don’t really care if people want to practice any religion — what I care about is (a) when they start telling other people that it’s the “True One” and (b) when it’s a stick with which to keep women in line. I worry about how people will consider religion as though it were somehow “true,” hence keep it in a separate social category, instead of seeing how it’s interwoven with every other social thing out there, eg. economics, women’s rights, etc. It’s the only thing that people can practice collectively while telling themselves it’s private. We made some inroads for a while by showing that the private is the political (hence social), but somehow that’s being rolled back. Scary scary, if you’re on the side of Enlightenment.

Oh, and I saw on the news (google) online that a number of Muslim sites in Holland were set on fire — how appropriate, on the Kristallnacht anniversary (Nov.9) that Dutch bigots would go out to torch the schools, mosques, and perhaps even homes of the Others. Now the event if fully in a vortex of us-them “values,” of something that has nothing to do anymore with women’s rights. It’s been hijacked completely by the idiots on both sides — religious fanatics here and xenophobic bigots there.

I’m just so discouraged and angry over how women are elided again and again so that men can have their “issues,” their fucking “culture wars,” their political crusades. I read this on the lefty blogs, too, and it makes my heart sink. For eg., Bush used the fact that a 19-year-old woman was the first voter in Afghanistan as political propaganda to fan support for his wars, and yet you don’t see the men jumping on this because it’s a co-optation of feminist efforts. No, they jump on it because it shows that Bush is retarded, or evil, or whatever, but never never as something he’s doing to hurt women. Everytime one of them ridicules Bush’s use of that 19-year old woman, he (and it’s typically men) should also point out that society hasn’t gotten friendlier for women, that it’s a sham to put that young woman on a pedestal. Yes, women have more rights now in Afghanistan, but Afghanistan isn’t Iraq. What Bush’s use of that 19-year old woman voter should provoke in lefty men is a reasoned account of why it’s propaganda to cite her, and why it’s a co-optation of feminism. That is, in Iraq things have gotten much worse for women, and that’s an issue we should be analysing and critiquing. But no, as soon as the atrocities mount, the women (who in civilian ranks bear the brunt of the worst of it) are forgotten, and the men try to outdo themselves in who can shout the loudest.

I’m not bitter, really. But I feel we won’t ever move from the spot (which is now a giant hole) if we don’t put women’s emancipation front and centre.

Must go and reread some Rosa Luxemburg, I think.

Hey Yule, thanks, for a detailed response to my concerns!

I think we agree that the extent to which Islamofacism is woven into the fabric of Islam itself (rather than being merely an extremist form) requires dispassionate investigation.

I’d even take it further and say that there’s something about religion qua religion that makes people (usually the male kind) want to be mean to (and control) other people (usually of the female kind). Well, either it makes them do it, or it seriously facilitates the process.

Again, bravo.

Don’t worry, Maria, I know you’re out there — and I hear you about the exhaustion. This constant spiraling is wearing me out, too. Anyone see any ground yet, or is there a ways yet to fall?

Yule: I wanted to leave a comment. What kept me from doing so wasn’t fear, but exhaustion. I am still exhausted and not much good in marshalling support for the points you make.

Nevertheless, I am now aware of not only what happened, but also of a largely invisible frame that throws a different light on the debate.

Thank you for doing all this reserach and for writing this up for us — especially during this week!

And ps: if the Christian Reconstructionists get their way, we’ll be in deep doo-doo here, too. They want to subject abortion providers to the death penalty, and possibly bring Biblical punishments back into vogue. (Execution for homosexuals, anyone??) Feminists need to meet across this madness of fundamentalism and say, “enough.” Those bastards (regardless of which faith they follow) really do want to push us back into the dark ages.